Am I missing something…? Locke killed Jacob not MIB.
Im sorry if this sounds very Naive but i was under the impression that MIB cannot kill Jacob himself which is why he needs the loophole to have someone else do his dirty work.
From my understanding Ben stabbed Jacob, yet jacob was still alive to speak to MIB (flocke) telling him that “they’re coming”.
MIB (flocke) then proceeded to kick Jacob into the fire whilst Jacob was still alive thus making him either Jacobs Murderer or at the Very least Co-Murderer. If we are to assume that the rules apply in which they cannot kill each other then this can only mean that the person to kill jacob WAS the real Locke.
We know the “RULE” applies to other people who have been on the island, namely Widmore and Ben after their meeting in widmores bedroom. We also know that some type of game is going on between them with Ben quite clearly stating “He changed the rules” after Martin Keemi had killed his daughter.
I wonder if there is a connection between these 2 circumstances of Ben/Widmore and Jacob/MIB all being enemys and not being able to kill each others adversery.
Very much agree, like your thoughts.
Me too. Never been a fan of the whole possession line of thinking. I don’t think MIB and Jacob are supernatural beings. More likely to be clever people.
Like the thinking of parallels between Jacob/MIB and Ben/Widmore too.
I thought that was strange as well. Perhaps it is viewed like the courts sometimes see it, that he was already “going to die” from the stab wounds, so kicking him into the fire was not what actually killed him? Although burning as he surely did, Jacob probably did not (if he in fact did) die from blood loss..
Also loving the theory because maybe Locke is still somehow alive!
then how do you explain lockes knowledge of their loophole discussion. and if mib did deal the final blow…then maybe jacob is still alive
I think it’s because Locke wants to believe his importance. Was it back in season 2 in the swan station where Des asked him “are you him?”, and Locke answered “yes I am!” but clearly didn’t really know what Des was on about? Well these two responses sound similar to me.
I could be wrong but I don’t think Locke particularly said anything that gives the impression that he’s MIB. Locke gave quite general answers to Jacob.
how is answering yes i am him to someone with a gun equivalent to agreeing to finding a “loophole and saying you have no idea what ive been through to be here”. and why answer “in a manner of speaking” to the answer have you two met before. if it was locke, he would of just answered yes.
you are all thinking too hard. id hate to be a lost writer, trying to show something and with clues and then having my audience automatically think the opposite to try and be one step ahead of me. if the writers do twists, there are clues in the writing and acting. not a complete dismissal of the clues.
ekolocation,
I could not agree more. Locke has always wanted to be special and important but the man we saw enter the statue and speak to Jacob was not the same Locke we all know and love.
When they got to the temple it was like Ben was about to bring them in, and then FLocke says nope! we are going under!
How else would he know that?
and where did he go when Ben was draining his hidden dirty bathtub?
i agree with you to a certain extent – technically (un)locke did kill Jacob, and if this alt. timeline business does come to head then i can understand it really being Locke (and being different for alt. reasons) and the knowledge of the island. But still, alt. timeline or not, when (Un)locke enteres, Jacob says ‘I see you found your loophole’. This is a reference to the earlier conversation between Jacob and MIB -‘One day, we’re/im going to find a loophole’
As stated above, i think we’re over thinking this one.. maybe because (Un)locke kicked him into the fire the island is gonna change for the worst.. or maybe Jacob isnt dead.
Ekolocation/Joshegs, this is my point exactly if it is MIB he cannot kill jacob yet does by kicking him in the fire and as you quite rightly point out he does have some recolection of the conversation on the beach which would indicate it isnt locke at all. Seems to me a bit of a pickle really.
And just out of interest about the lost writers Ekolocation just how many times have you been right about something on this site? Im betting from reading your theories that the bad ones outweigh the good.
Thanks for the constructive comments of all others.
my theories are just as right and wrong as the theories of those in the show itself. you are missing my point, i am not tooting my own horn. my point is that the writers arent going to make a major scene worthless by making it a lie.
Right we are all friends and are here for the same purpose. I think we are misunderstanding each other here, what i was trying to say is that its that major scene that has caused me to rethink the whole MIB situation.
I was adament only a few weeks ago that locke was MIB but going by the “Rule” it has puzzled me.
No disrespect was meant to you.
You guys talk about clues in the show, but are using one conversation that is still left a bit ambiguous. He didn’t say ‘hey, look I’m MIB possessing a body so I can kill you.’ That the loophole means Jacob’s death has also been left ambiguous. There are clues the whole way through the entire show that lead the other way. We’ve been shown the ‘rules’ as such for smokie’s appearances and none of them have been like Locke, he’s eating a mango, he had Locke’s memories – not just talkiing to someone, but we have John flashbacks AFTER Ajira crashes, his body is there and the writers have been very careful to make a point of no bodies when smokie appears, if MIB can ‘be’ someone else then so should Jacob (they’ve been set up as equals) so why not just ‘look’ like someone else so MIB doesn’t know who to kill? If MIB is Locke and he can kill Jacob, why not just kill Jacob on the beach?
The only clue you have to Locke being MIB is an ambiguous conversation which could be explained through a number of ways, it’s not cut and dry.
The scene will not be worthless. We’re going to have to wait and see what brought this version of John Locke to Jacobs statue to kill him.
Watch Flocke from the time he got back to the island. It seems like Locke to me. So was that a lie.
If someone had theorised before The Incident that Locke was actually MIB, you would have called that thinking to hard.
How in the world could anyone possibly think that is Locke. It is not even close, if you are a true die hard fan of John Locke you know that is not him as much as I wish it was. His facial expressions his mannerisms plus anytime there is anything having to do with smokey JL knows everything about it and anytime smokey is present JL conveniently is not and then he conveniently reappears as soon as smokey leaves. Plus there have been times when people have been talking about smokey and then Locke shows up outta no where outta the woods or something, that’s called foreshadowing. That is a completely different person than John Locke
I’m with Tas. My main point a while ago on this thread was that the conversation was ambiguous like may in Lost.
Look AS31 ive never said im a “Die hard fan of John Locke” its not even mentioned on this theory that i like him at all so please accept my apologies that i have insulted your thoughts on your hero.
Well considering through 5 seasons it seems as though Locke has been the most pivotal and important character on the show i would have thought you would have paid a little more attention to him. And if you don’t think Locke is great then i feel bad for you cause you really dont get the show and youre missing out. I’m hoping your favorite character isnt kate or sayid or someone like that.
For the record, Sayid *is* my favorite LOST characters.
I agree that the apparent rules which include MIB and Jacob not being able to directly kill one another would lead to some ambiguity regaridng Jacob’s death and MIB (as UnLocke)’s part in it.
I am in the UnLocke is NOT Locke school of thought. I can’t explain the Mango. That could be a red herring, and is the snag in the theory, for sure. Still I’m going with MIB is or is in control of UnLocke. Now what if this. What if Jacob’s last words (They’re coming) and MIB’s obviously strong reaction to that- including burning Jacob- was not actually furthering his death but by deliberate rule breaking was actually saving him? Perhaps the “they” who are coming are the other side of a war they both need to fight?
OR… perhaps MIB forgot the rule and sought to destroy Jacob fully as he prepared to fight against the “they” who are all of Jacob’s “pieces” about to turn up in 2007? This might be a loophole for Jacob to resurface alive at some point in S6.
In any case, the nuance of unLocke rolling Jacob technically still alive into the fire is an intriguing detail- whether it was MIB or Locke himself!
Yikes, sorry about the terrible spelling in my last post. I was typing quickly, distracted and forgot to re-read before submitting.
AS31, Locke in season 5 is acting like Locke from 1-4 with a whole pile more confidence.He’s like the difference between someone who was questioning themselves at works, am I doing the right thing, is my work any good, then landing a top account. The posture, manner of speaking all shifts slightly but it’s the same person.
I would have thought that such a Locke fan would be devastated at the character arc they’ve then given him if he is just possessed. He ends with the ultimate con, manipulated into killing himself then not even given the dignity to do that himself. John Locke is too much of an important character to kill off like that. And if he’s dead, how does the Jack/Locke storyline resolve? On the Locke/smokie thing, someone beought up in a recent theory that smokie is in dharmaville when frans and Sun turn up (you also see it when they walk into the rec room) Locke was with Ben on Hydra island then.
AS31 i agree Locke is an important character but to be honest i dont think its about any one character in this show, everybody plays there part and i have enjoyed the growth and demise of all of the characters to have graced it, however if push came to shove and i was to choose a favourite then i would opt for Benjamin Linus. Thouroughly great character.